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Oct. 11, 2006

Administration's new ID policy is more than the sum of its punishments

by Priyanka Gokhale, Online Editor-in-Chief
At a glance, Blair's new ID Policy seems daunting and uncalled for. Saturday detention? For not wearing a small plastic rectangle? However, when examined more thoroughly, the administration's new ID policy is a sure step forward.

What jumps out about the new policy is the implementation of immediate disciplinary action when IDs are forgotten or not worn. According to the policy, students will have the opportunity to buy IDs from attendance secretary Roxanne Fus in the attendance office before the second bell During first block, security guards will bring temporary IDs for anyone who needs them, and students will be allowed two per quarter. Punishments for ID refractions ranging from forgetting an ID multiple times to refusal to wear an ID include calls home, parent-administrator meetings and suspension.

Generally, Blazers fall into four categories regarding IDs: the regular wearers, the occasional forgetters, the serial forgetters and those who refuse to wear them – the latter three are the ones affected by the new policy.

For people who occasionally forget their IDs and don't want to shell out $5 every time an ID is left on the counter or in another binder, the new policy is a great alternative. Instead of paying for replacement IDs that may never be used again, students can receive a free ID sticker to be worn for that day. If students do lose their IDs, they have the option of buying a new one, and saving their two temporary IDs for later.

The new policy will also help Blazers who regularly forget IDs. The third time an ID is forgotten, a parent-administration conference will be set up. Imagine what your parents would say if they had to go to school because you weren't wearing an ID!

Then there are the Blazers – a large majority of the students – who simply don't wear their IDs. Yes, ID's are a nuisance to wear, look nerdy and sometimes clash with outfits. But, whether the student body likes it or not, IDs are here to stay. In the workforce, whether you are a janitor in a hospital or the executive CEO at a large corporation, IDs are a part of the get-up. Saturday detention as a first offense is a very harsh punishment, but it's the administration's way of shedding light on the importance of wearing IDs. Although Blazers may not agree with the concept of IDs, the school administration certainly believes in them, and they are here to stay – at least for now.

Yes, the punishments are harsh. But, they are also easily avoidable. The solution is simple – wear your ID or temporary ID daily. Instead of complaining about the policy, we should summon up the energy to put on the lanyard and go about our lives as students.

In the end, rules are rules. And at school, the rule is straightforward – "wear your ID." And, if we, the student body, follow this rule, we won't need to complain about the punishments. The new ID policy seems cruel and unforgiving, but its main purpose is to help Blazers remember to bring and wear IDs daily, and possibly save $5 along the way.

Please click here for coverage of the ID policy and its history.



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  • Jon Phoenix Brookstone on October 11, 2006 at 1:59 PM
    Bull!!!! Id's may be here, but nothing says that they have to stay. We are the only school in the county that makes it mandatory to wear IDs. The original reason for that requirement (according to Chips editors) is because the school building was build near a dangerous intersection, and wearing plastic rectangles inside would clearly eliminate all skipping forever and stop traffic fatalities outside. During the first five weeks of school, we got along fine without IDs - no anarchy and no ID related injuries. Therefore, it perfectly possible for this school to function without them, and is conceivable that the school administration, in the face of rising costs, delays, and student pressure, might at some future time wisely choose to scrap this requirement.

    Whether or not people or companies wear Ids in the future is irrelevant. What is relevant is that we, the students, are in high school, not the professional world. School is not supposed to have all the fun regimented out of it through the threat of punishment. School is not supposed to be run as a prison or a business. School is school, and should be a place where students aren't consistently irritated by nonsensical policies and really like to learn.

    There is more to this than just putting on a lanyard. It's also about what type of place school should be.
  • counter on October 11, 2006 at 4:30 PM
    Well said Brookstone.

    Even in businesses, most companies do not have IDs. I live near Perry Parkway (there are about 25 companies there) and none of them require IDs. It is mostly government businesses and large corporations that require IDs to eliminate the risk of espionage. Newspapers do it as well. However, most of the U.S. is small business, I think around 80%.

    And seriously, what point is there to this ID policy?

    1) It would do absolutely nothing to prevent school shootings. It is extremely easy to don a fake ID.

    2) The time when it is most important to have IDs is the only time when it is not enforced. IDs are checked during class times, and the class will definitely know who belongs there and who doesn't. During breaks and lunch, there is no effort (and no possible method) to enforce IDs.

    3) We had gone through an entire month without IDs, and nothing went wrong. Though this is just speculation, I believe that if something were to happen, having IDs in the school would not prevent it.

    So what is the point I'm trying to make?

    1) The administration wants to stress the importance of wearing IDs with this new policy. But there is no importance! IDs will never fulfill its purpose of creating a safer environment.

    2) Since there is no importance, why stress over it? You can state that the administration is trying to make better habits in the kids, but as I already pointed out, IDs are rarely used in the real world.

    3) I'm not stating that we should simply eliminate IDs. I'm just saying that we should have a laissez-faire policy - let the students decide if they want to wear it. There is no need to have such harsh discipline simply for "not wearing a small plastic rectangle."
  • SGW on October 11, 2006 at 4:35 PM
    Well said, Priyanka. I enjoyed reading your reasonable and well thought-out opinion.
  • Eli Barnett on October 11, 2006 at 4:57 PM
    I completely agree. And might i add that you dont have infinite temporary ID's. And a meeting with the parents will NOT help the student, it will simply be annoying to the parents. The new ID policy is NOT a step foward. Allow me to explain. First off, ID's are not used in a professional atmosphere (which Jon Brookstone stated before me, we are not) as things that are worn while you are in the workplace. They are used to enter and exit buildings. Relating this policy to a professional workplace is pure idiocy. And the administration, whether they will admit it or not, knows it. Secondly, this policy does something that no id policy should do. It punishes the students, yet the administration repeats that it is aimed at keeping outsiders out of the school. Tell me, what is the problem with a student not having an ID as long as you can verify that he is a student? If someone forgets their ID, they still have their ID number. That is enough to verify that someone is a student. The policy shouldnt penalize students that forget their ID's, but instead just be the slight annoyance of having to give your ID number. If someone ISNT a student, THEN, and only then do you have a problem. Another major problem is that, on several occasions, it contradicts itself. And not with petty things, but with major points its trying to make. Allow me to quote it (may not be exact wording, but close), "although we will punish you if you dont wear your ID's, you should be wearing them willingly." Tell me, does that make sense? Is there any way someone can wear something willingly if they know that they will be punished if they dont? No. This policy is simply asking to annoy the students even more, and force rediculously harsh punishments on them. Throughout your article, you never adressed what the ID policy is for: Keeping people who dont belong here out. And if i may say so, it does a HORRIBLE job at it. You cannot tell if someone is wearing an ID in the hallways, its simply not possible with 3,000 students. Sure, the teachers do a good job of checking for them, but people who dont belong here probably wont be in the classes. In fact, from what i have seen, anyone can get into the school right now in the morning, rob someone, and get out. There is nothing to stop them, certainly not an ID. Note that having a piece of plastic on a string around your neck does not summon up a magic shield to protect you from harm. You make the too often made point that "rules are meant to be followed." You leave out the fact that rules can be WRONG. Im not saying people should ignore the rules if they are wrong, im saying that if a policy is wrong, and the student body is, obviously, indicating that it is, then there is no reason to tell the student body to "deal with it" for policies as rediculous as this. Change is needed to help make our school a better place, and this is one thing that NEEDS to be changed.

    To wrap this up, i would like to say that the ID policy is a waste of resources, time, and energy that could be spent doing something that helps the school, not doing something that annoys the student body.
  • Republican on October 11, 2006 at 6:18 PM
    IDs are much more than a piece of plastic you hang around your neck. It is the only thing universal among the students that the school recognizes. There are ID numbers but that would a hassle to check. The only thing that the administration can safely say every student has is an ID. It is the only bond between the students of the school. Without it, any random person out on the street can become a blazer and walk the halls during lunch.

    As Brookstone said, we are the only school in the county that requires us to wear IDs. But does that make wearing IDs bad? No! Many Blazers can disagree with IDs but it still does not make wearing the IDs a bad thing.

    There is nothing that you can say that wearing an ID around your neck would cause you any physical or mental harm so shush, it's just a method by the administration to keep a school of several thousand students running.

    Now, as Priyanka said, the only problem with this new policy are the punishments. Look at the punishments; they are reflective of the problems the school had in the previous years. We have bought this new policy onto ourselves. Last year, people owed the school hundreds of dollars because of IDs. It was overwhelming. Blair did something about it, they threaten the students with punishments. It is not until the third offense that things get serious, and before then, you'll even get an annoying phone call that tells you to bring your ID. In addition, even if you forget to bring your ID, you can always go somewhere before first period to buy one. Is that not a perfectly reasonable policy?

    Another problem many students pointed out is the Saturday detention (breakfast club). The only way you can get that is if a teacher looks you straight in the eye, asks you to put your ID on, and you ignore the teacher and walk on. That is not just a silly offense, that is almost the same as cursing a teacher. That makes perfect sense and people are making a huge deal about the respect they should show for their fellow human beings.

    So, in short, IDs are not hurting anyone and it is only a method to keep track of the students. The punishments are an attempt by the administration to destroy any problems that happened last year.

    I forgot to mention this up there, but Brookstone, look at your planbook. It's full of rules that "regiment" the fun out of school. Oh sadness!, I can't hit a fellow student.
  • Blazer on October 11, 2006 at 6:28 PM
    It isn't totally rediculous. I love the free ID temorary ID stickers (I probably fall into the "occasional forgetters" category.

    What I don't like about the ID policy is I don't feel like it protects us. I don't mind wearing it everyday, as long as it's effective.

    No one seems happy with this policy, I think that may be a cue for change.
  • Bob (View Email) on October 11, 2006 at 6:32 PM
    i would agree with everything

    ONLY IF

    there were a point in IDs

    if someone really wanted to attack us, they would plan it out way better than letting an id get in the way

    if it's to "build character" or some crap to make forgetters repent, homework does that doesn't it?

    i think id's are something similar to what bush has right now...the administration made a mistake but are too proud to let it go away and have the lesser ones mock them, so instead they take away some students chances at a better college by smacking a suspension on their record

    Last year it was taxation without representation

    this year its suspending habeas corpus with no cause
  • vJ on October 11, 2006 at 6:46 PM
    Well said Brookstone, Counter, and Barnett. I don't know why you wrote this article Priyanka, but the main points here are:
    1) Rules can be wrong
    2) The ID policy does not make us safer
    3) The ID policy wastes money, time, & manpower
    So I have no idea how you could ever say to just wear it and get along and be happy and not do anything because that is absolutely ridiculous.
  • Apathetic on October 11, 2006 at 7:18 PM
    You say the main purpose of the new ID policy is to "help Blazers remember to bring and wear IDs daily." Well, what is the purpose of THAT? The people who commented before me have raised excellent points regarding the utter uselessness of IDs. This is like the administration saying "The purpose of the ID policy is to insure all students are are wearing an ID." What kind of purpose is that?

    You did not address why IDs are needed in the first place. If IDs were needed, then the policy would at least make a little sense. The question isn't "Is the new policy good?" but rather "Is any policy necessary at all?"

    The main reason cited for IDs has always been "security." Obviously, in the administration's view, "a small rectangular piece of plastic" can protect students from harm. I'm sure said plastic can stop a bullet, should a psycho decide to pull a shooting.

    Although "in the end, rules are rules" and although this "rule is straightforward" it is also unfounded, unjustified, and plain ridiculous.

    I would like to once again call on the administration to defend THEIR policy. I emphasize "their" because SGA is held powerless, helpless under the tyranny of the administration, while the PTSA is timidly toadying to the administration. Thank you.
  • agreement on October 11, 2006 at 7:20 PM
    I agree with the author's position, because if you wear your ID the policy will not be detrimental to you, but it will help because of the temporary IDs. The policy actually enforces the ID policy, unlike last year when if you were anywhere but in the magnet hall, you could usually get away w/o wearing an ID.
  • annoyed on October 11, 2006 at 7:58 PM
    If, as the Chips Index suggests, 93% of Blazers say that they have worn someone else's ID all day, what does that say about our ID policy?
  • Clear Thinker on October 11, 2006 at 9:00 PM
    Thank you Silver Chips for finally showing the pros of IDs and by fairly representing both sides of the argument. This article is the first thing I have read that was not based completely on anger towards the administeration and does not contain logical fallacies such a 'poisoning the well' as all the others are guilty of by calling the administration names. Maybe the Ids make us safe and maybe they dont. But who are we to decide as students. Have faith that the people who run our school have done their research and know what they are doing. I find it hard to believe that these people got to the high positions they did by making foolish and stupid decisions you say they do by enforcing the ID policy. Once again I applaud Priyanka and the SCO staff for allowing the other side of the argument to be heard. And in case you are wondering why the administration does not just come out and explain themselves it is simple. They shouldn't have to. They are the staff, we are the students. They deserve our respect and so do their rules and this article perfecty lays out the reasons behind the rules in case the reason 'because I said so' doesn't fly with you.
  • Keisha on October 11, 2006 at 9:20 PM
    Priyanka, I hope you wrote this because SCO needed to present the other side of the ID policy and not because you actually believe it...
  • Libertarian (View Email) on October 11, 2006 at 9:53 PM
    hmm, Clear Thinker seems to show him/herself as anything but that. While I agree the other side should be heard (and I'm still waiting on the administration's side as to why we are safer), I disagree and am simply horrified at attitudes such as this:

    "But who are we to decide as students. Have faith that the people who run our school have done their research and know what they are doing."

    People do that in real life as well, with the government. Question everything. If you have thought about it and logically believe ID's help, that's one thing. But to blindly go with the administration because they are "better" than us and know what they're doing is not good. Big Brother anyone?

    Again with the disgusting quotes, I'm beginning to think this was written by someone in the administration:

    "And in case you are wondering why the administration does not just come out and explain themselves it is simple. They shouldn't have to. They are the staff, we are the students. They deserve our respect and so do their rules and this article perfecty lays out the reasons behind the rules in case the reason 'because I said so' doesn't fly with you."

    They are paid with OUR tax money. This is a PUBLIC school. They are not meant to rule over us, but to be acting in our best interest. There are some instances where they may say "it doesn't matter what you think, we get the last call". Yet they should still explain what they are doing, even if it is followed by "I don't care if you like it, but that's what's going to happen and that's why". I still haven't even heard something of that nature. and this article shows why??? Where? I've read it 5 times now. It mentions how the policy isn't so bad, but never mentions why ID's are necessary. The best support for having ID's is "they are here to stay - at least for now" (I'm going to ignore the self-contradictory sentence). I could use a similar argument for slavery. "It's here to stay, you get free food and a place to sleep. It's not up to us to explain ourselves, we are superior. It's simple, just do your work, it's not that hard". Like that logic? I didn't think so.
  • Libertarian (View Email) on October 11, 2006 at 10:00 PM
    You know, I read the title of this article and thought "finally someone gets it" and I read it and find out it's totally against what I believe. The ID policy is more than the sum of its punishments. On the face, it's not that bad. It may even seem downright reasonable now that it's only Saturday detention if you refuse to put it on. The problem is not the specific policy, it's the general attitude of the staff and students. The staff now has an additional job, to force kids to wear ID's. Most staff don't understand why so they simply say "put it on". How many of you have seen a teacher say "put on your ID", only to walk away and not even notice if they put it on or not? Aren't they concerned about our safety? What if that were an intruder in our school?

    Do you really think Ms. Piper, Dvorsky, Collins, Dyas, etc. tell people to put on ID's for safety reasons? What are their motives? They simply think kids should wear ID's and they get to have fun with their newfound power, telling anyone and everyone to "put your ID on".

    Also, the most recent school shooting was an adult in the school. Why is this focused so much on students and not teachers/administrators/visitors? Aren't they the highest risk? How many problems have occured with kids coming from other schools during a school day to commit an act of violence? We are attacking the wrong problem the wrong way, and it is creating an air of police vs. criminal within the student body. ID's are pointless, I have not seen one GOOD argument for them yet, yet people enjoy saying "put your ID on", not caring about the safety of any student, only about following the rules to the letter.
  • Louis Wasserman (View Email) on October 11, 2006 at 10:09 PM
    I'd rather pay $5 than go to a Saturday detention. Why not just charge $5 for the first six to seven offenses each *then* go to a Saturday detention? That'd make most of the student body considerably happier than they are now, I think.
  • Thanks Priyanka on October 11, 2006 at 10:20 PM
    It's really not that big of a deal. Whether or not IDs are effective, if you are not paying money for it, why not just accept it. Rules can be wrong, and sometimes should be changed. But when having a "wrong" rule doesn't really matter, then why are we always here arguing about it. Let it be. If there weren't a change to the policy, this whole forum wouldn't even exist... AND THAT IS NOT A HYPOTHESIS CONTRARY TO FACT, since there weren't any extensive argument about it during previous years when there weren't changes to ID policies...
  • Jordan Turner (View Email) on October 11, 2006 at 11:14 PM
    Clear Thinker, I agree that some of the comments against the ideas are written in states of rage and you are entitled to agree with Priyanka. But your suggestion that those against the policy should just sit down and be quiet is quite disheartening. Think Martin Luther King, Jr. Or Mahatma Gandhi. I know objecting to the ID policy isn't going to change the world, but it is our duty as citizens to speak up against something we believe is flawed and unfair...

    "They are the staff, we are the students. They deserve our respect..."

    That's not respect; that's acquiescence and they do not deserve that at all.

    "I find it hard to believe that these people got to the high positions they did by making foolish and stupid decisions"

    No, they probably did not get to their high positions by making foolish and stupid decisions, and nobody has suggested that (it seems like you just committed a logical fallacy of your own). However, it is certainly possible that a flawed decision could be made by the administration.

    Again, I find it real sad to see anyone saying that when an explanation is requested none should be given just because we're students. That's a frightening, discouraging philosophy to carry on in life...
  • ... on October 12, 2006 at 7:49 AM
    Jon Phoenix Brookstone :: 10/11/2006, 1:59 PM
    Bull!!!! Id's may be here, but nothing says that they have to stay. We are the only school in the county that makes it mandatory to wear IDs. The original reason for that requirement (according to Chips editors) is because the school building was build near a dangerous intersection, and wearing plastic rectangles inside would clearly eliminate all skipping forever and stop traffic fatalities outside. During the first five weeks of school, we got along fine without IDs - no anarchy and no ID related injuries. Therefore, it perfectly possible for this school to function without them, and is conceivable that the school administration, in the face of rising costs, delays, and student pressure, might at some future time wisely choose to scrap this requirement.

    Whether or not people or companies wear Ids in the future is irrelevant. What is relevant is that we, the students, are in high school, not the professional world. School is not supposed to have all the fun regimented out of it through the threat of punishment. School is not supposed to be run as a prison or a business. School is school, and should be a place where students aren't consistently irritated by nonsensical policies and really like to learn.

    There is more to this than just putting on a lanyard. It's also about what type of place school should be.






    sheesh just wear ur id.....
  • To: Clear Thinker on October 12, 2006 at 8:37 AM
    speaking of fallacies

    hasty generalization:
    "as all the others are guilty of by calling the administration names."
    some of the comments are coherent, reasonable criticisms of the policy with no name-calling involved

    hypothesis contrary to fact:
    "They are the staff, we are the students. They deserve our respect and so do their rules"
    we should not blindly follow what the administration says just because they are the administration; if they are doing something wrong we should point it out

    If you want to condemn our fallacies, don't make your own. Go and see if IDs really help make us safe at all, then come back with some arguments.
  • サク on October 12, 2006 at 4:32 PM
    I'm not sure if this is a good thing or not.
    But I've went a day without wearing one and didn't get caught.

    I know that there are people that come to check in first period..but at least s/he can ask everyone to hold it up for a check.
    All the person has said to my class is, "Does anyone NOT have an ID?"

    ...Who in the world would say, "No I don't"?
    Yeah.

    I think IDs are just ridiculous to begin with.
    I know that it's suppose to provide safety to the school. But honestly. I have seen strangers walk in without and ID and not be pulled over and asked.

    And I mean...if you don't check, then what's the point?
  • wow on October 12, 2006 at 7:23 PM
    GOOD STORY
    we finnaly here from the OTHER side of the truth and it makes me think
    still the segregation is the annying part not the idea of wearing it
  • Eli Barnett on October 12, 2006 at 8:28 PM
    Libertarian did a great job of stating this, and im going to say it outright. This is the problem with both our schools administration AND our countries administration. people forget that they exist to serve the PEOPLE (or in our case the students). The do not exist because "they know better than us" or because "they are the staff and we are the students" and thats just how it goes. No, our families pay them. They are not simply people who help us out of will, our tax dollars go to pay for them to work for US. not for them to impose idiotic policies which to the exact opposite of that. The administration seems to believe that it exits to boss around the students. Wrong. The administration exists to make the school a more organized place in the interests of the students. Now dont go tell me that they know our interests better than we do, they do NOT. Dont say that its the parents interests, from what i can tell the parents are against this policy too. This is an example of the administration doing something purely because they have the power to. Not because its a good idea, they know and we know very well that this policy does NOTHING. this was done because they could do it and they wanted to do it. As for them even enforcing their policy, the only time i have seen it done was in class by the teachers (would someone who doesnt belong in here even be in class?) or kicking people out of the lunch line for not having the ID (which is even more rediculous than the punishments, you do NOT have the right to deny food to the students who forgot their ID's). And dont say that you can go get a temporary one so easily. Getting a temporary ID can usually only be done in the morning, and its a real pain. To me, its not very clear even where you get them.

    To Clear Thinker,
    Im seriously thinking an administration member posted this, because its full of things which the adminitration shows it believes. For one, it says that the administration knows our interests better than we (and our parents) do. Someone please tell me that a student didnt post that, because a student WOULDNT post that. Who in the world actually says that they and their families dont know their own interests, and that other people do? no one. The administration did not do this for us. We know it. They know it. You also say we should accept the explaination of "because i said so." Is that EVER a good way to go about life? Tell me, if everyone did what the bush administration wanted them to do because "they said so," would our country be in a better position than it is now? NO. This is a real life example of why you should never listen to people for the sake of "they said so and they know better than you." I am not going to simply let the administration do whatever it wants because it has power. Thats not how i think, and it never will be. Im sure me, and many others, will continue to fight this policy, no matter what the administration tells us to do.

    As for the arguement stated by many that "it doesnt matter," thats not true. Many people forget their ID's not out of not wanting to wear them, but out of absent mindedness. I will admit that i am a very forgetful person. not because i want to forget, many things i forget are things that would benefit me (such as having my keys with me). Not everyone doesnt have an ID because they dont want to. So saying it doesnt matter and that its not hard the wear the ID isnt a very good argument. Please keep in mind that not everyone is perfect, and that this policy does indeed affect people.

    As for the final (and i think by now universally held as false ) argument, that the ID's make us safer, they dont. As stated in too many posts for me to count, this policy has more holes in it than swiss cheese. Anyone could come into the school if they didnt have an ID, nothing would stop them, maybe they wouldnt be able to buy lunch, but thats about it. Please rethink this argument and stop using it. its false.
  • Anarchist on October 13, 2006 at 2:55 AM
    I wonder if the administration can point to a single event (any incident at all) in which a culprit was identified/made more visible because he/she did not have an ID.

    In other words, has the policy EVER succeeded in preventing a crime at Blair?
  • Republican on October 13, 2006 at 4:40 PM
    Instead of pointing out how the ID's are useless, I challenge someone to point out how the ID's are harmful to the student.

    Someone please tell me what is wrong with hanging a piece of plastic around your neck. It does not hurt; it does not embarass; it does not do anything bad. The only "bad" parts of this ID policy are the ones that we bring onto ourselves.

    We forget to bring our ID; we must pay for a replacement ID. Is that not fair? It's the same as we must buy books and paper for school.

    We refuse to wear our ID when asked; that is insubordination. Is that not fair as well?

    As I said before, the IDs are the only obvious difference between a student and non-student. IDs are useful; they are needed.

    The new ID policy attempts to fix many problems that existed. There is nothing wrong with it. With it in effect, it isn't as bad as thought. The only real difference is the security guard coming around each day and that is only for a second or two.

    It's hard to earn the punishments and if you earn it, you deserve it.

    Stop complaining if you can only point fingers at the administration and can't point fingers at the actual problem with IDs.
  • Libertarian (View Email) on October 13, 2006 at 4:42 PM
    To Anarchist,

    To be fair, no one claims that it would have prevented a previous event at Blair, they're just claiming that should an event like that happen at Blair, ID's would keep us safer. So that's a bit unfair. But maybe they'll take my challenge.

    Show how, if the ID policy were implemented at another school, it would have prevented it or lessened the damage, or if that school had an ID policy how that policy helped prevent the attack or lessen the damage. I doubt they can do that, which is the fundamental reason I am against the ID policy. If it actually came close to keeping us safe, I may be sympathetic to their side, but they don't and I'm not.
  • Eli Barnett on October 13, 2006 at 7:42 PM
    to republican: The severity of the punishments is how its harmful. its hard to get a replacement, its not entirely clear where to get a temporary one, and you get suspensions if you dont have it. The fact that its punishing the students is the bad part. Sure, they may have had problems in the past, but it does not justify anything this severe.
  • Libertarian (View Email) on October 13, 2006 at 7:51 PM
    To Republican, "Instead of pointing out how the ID's are useless, I challenge someone to point out how the ID's are harmful to the student." Sure, I will. But this is horrible logic. In both the government and any structure such as a school system, the burden of proof should be on the people in power to justify doing something. They shouldn't simply be able to do something for no reason simply because it "does no harm". That said, I believe this does do harm. I'll address that later. "Someone please tell me what is wrong with hanging a piece of plastic around your neck. It does not hurt; it does not embarass; it does not do anything bad. The only "bad" parts of this ID policy are the ones that we bring onto ourselves." It is a bit uncomfortable, and read up on the new ID policy. Many ESOL and other groups (Freshmen especially this week) are embarassed because it is obvious that they are in that academy/program/grade. "We forget to bring our ID; we must pay for a replacement ID. Is that not fair? It's the same as we must buy books and paper for school." Books and paper have specific uses in school, ID's do not. "We refuse to wear our ID when asked; that is insubordination. Is that not fair as well?" Agreed. "As I said before, the IDs are the only obvious difference between a student and non-student. IDs are useful; they are needed. " Really? Do we really need to go into how easy it is to fake an ID? Do we need to question why a non-student would want to be in a school? The only bad reason would be if they wanted to cause harm to a mass of people. ID's do not stop that, no one has given me ONE way that ID's could help in that type of situation. "The new ID policy attempts to fix many problems that existed. There is nothing wrong with it. With it in effect, it isn't as bad as thought. The only real difference is the security guard coming around each day and that is only for a second or two." And here you address only the new policy. I'm questioning the entire policy of having mandatory ID's (we're the only MCPS school that has that BTW) to be worn at all times in the building. And you saying that "there is nothing wrong with it" doesn't make it so. If you could use a few facts that would be nice. "Stop complaining if you can only point fingers at the administration and can't point fingers at the actual problem with IDs." I have continually pointed fingers at the problems and the fact that despite that the administration continues to enforce the policy. Who else should I point my finger at for enforcing a dumb policy?
  • Apathetic on October 13, 2006 at 9:27 PM
    To Republican: "I challenge someone to point out how the ID's are harmful to the student." Well, for one, there is the ISS penalty. Just for forgetting your ID (I think it was the 5th time), a student can get ISS. It's quite easy to forget your ID 5 times a quarter. Let's see what other offenses merit ISS: Cheating, forgery, "rough playing/play fighting", using skateboards etc. in the building, and truancy (and possibly others.) Compared to these, does simply forgetting an ID warrant an ISS? The harm done here is, for such a simple "offense" the student has to miss a whole day's worth of classes. In a learning environment, depriving a student of a whole day's worth of education (which the parents pay for in taxes, I might add) is nonsensical. This is a school. The purpose is to learn. So, in order to implement a useless ID policy/ID system, you deprive the student of the whole point of school? Nice. . . "Someone please tell me what is wrong with hanging a piece of plastic around your neck. It does not hurt; it does not embarass; it does not do anything bad. The only "bad" parts of this ID policy are the ones that we bring onto ourselves. " Though it may seem pedantic, it CAN hurt. I know my ID has gotten caught on various things over the year, giving my neck a nasty jerk. In sophomore year, I used one of those ball bearing type necklace/strings to wear my ID, and the ID got caught on a lunch table and shattered the string. I might also add that it increases segregation, and possibly hazing. This point has been argued before, and I'm sure you have read it before; therefore, I will not outline it here. . . "We forget to bring our ID; we must pay for a replacement ID. Is that not fair? It's the same as we must buy books and paper for school." This is reasonable--if the IDs were necessary in the first place. The punishment is way over the top, however. . . "We refuse to wear our ID when asked; that is insubordination. Is that not fair as well? " Again, it would be fair if it made sense to wear IDs in the first place. If there is no reason, why should the student wear an ID? It has been a long time since the first call for the administration to explain the necessity of the ID policy; we have yet to receive a logical, clear explanation. The vague "security issues" and "the purpose of the ID policy is to insure all students wear an ID" are clearly bull. . . "As I said before, the IDs are the only obvious difference between a student and non-student. IDs are useful; they are needed. " Please explain how this makes them useful or needed. . . "The new ID policy attempts to fix many problems that existed. There is nothing wrong with it. With it in effect, it isn't as bad as thought. The only real difference is the security guard coming around each day and that is only for a second or two. " Look beyond yourself and your own life. Perhaps for you, or people who aren't forgetful, there is no difference. But forgetfulness is rather common, and I'm pretty sure that most forgetful people would rather not be forgetful. Secondly, the fact that security only stays for a second or two shows that they aren't checking as diligently as they should be, if the "security risk" is as great as the adminstration seems to think it is. As someone mentioned, they merely ask if anyone doesn't have an ID; they don't actually check. . . "Stop complaining if you can only point fingers at the administration and can't point fingers at the actual problem with IDs." The main issue is the uselessness and pointlessness of IDs. What other school has them? Blair is defintely not the most dangerous school in the county.
  • Curious (View Email) on October 16, 2006 at 8:19 AM
    Just curious -- but how many non-id wearers have their location for evacuations memorized? In the event of something bad happening would you know, without looking at your id where to be accounted for? If you were hurt in the building, without your id, how could someone quickly identify the students from the non-students and determine who you were. Just curious.
  • To Republican on October 16, 2006 at 9:44 PM
    Is it really fair to *earn* a punishment equal to that of getting into a fight or cussing at your teacher simply for forgetting or taking off your ID? This isn't the army, this is Blair, a public high school. Under the terms of last year's ID policy, students were not subjugated to such harsh punishments, and guess what? There were no bombings, no shootings, and no mass chaos.

    "As I said before, the IDs are the only obvious difference between a student and non-student. IDs are useful; they are needed."
    Perhaps a more obvious difference between a student and non-student would be the fact that a non-student wouldn't come sit in a Blair class, where IDs are checked. Or if they did, let's hope the teacher notices before security on their ID check does. :/

    "We forget to bring our ID; we must pay for a replacement ID. Is that not fair? It's the same as we must buy books and paper for school."
    Yeah that analogy works except that students actually USE paper and books, and they serve some greater purpose in the overall education and achievment of a student. Which is the purpose of a school. And IDs? Not so much.

    Maybe we'd be able to look a little closer at the actual problems with IDs if the administration bothered to tell us their purpose in the first place. How can problems with the policy be identified if they won't even explain why IDs are applicable and beneficial to our learning or learning environment as students?
  • Eli Barnett on October 17, 2006 at 8:47 AM
    to republican: You obviously havent been reading the posts if you think all we have been doing is saying its useless. As libertarian said, asking us to provide a reason to not have it is horrible logic by itself, but let me reiterate some previous arguments. First of all, its a big inconvenience to people who forget the ID. Its not a pain to wear, but if you forget it 3 times or forget to put it on after gym class you get a saturday detention. Is that fair to the students? no. The severity the punishments is also a big problem. Suspension for not bringing an ID? what kind of crap is that? The administration knows that this is wrong, and the fact that the SGA claims to have reduced the punishments makes me wonder what they were origonally planning. The nature of this policy makes MBHS more like a prison and less like a school. Is that how we want to appear? I dont think anyone is really in favor of this policy, and that being the case, it should be removed.
  • Libertarian (View Email) on October 17, 2006 at 5:07 PM
    "Just curious -- but how many non-id wearers have their location for evacuations memorized? In the event of something bad happening would you know, without looking at your id where to be accounted for?" - Curious

    Personally, yes. We've had a fire drill. You should know generally where your section is and then be able to find your teacher and other kids in your homeroom. And if you can't I believe that information is also on your schedule, although I could be wrong.


    "If you were hurt in the building, without your id, how could someone quickly identify the students from the non-students and determine who you were. Just curious." - Curious

    Would it matter? They would have to find out eventually, but immediately they should worry about getting you to a hospital, since you're unconscious. They would then have some time. Maybe they should require you put your name on your backpack so they can quickly identify you. There are several ways without a rule making ID's mandatory. Also what about other schools? Have they had that problem?

    Good questions, but there are other solutions besides ID's.
  • Republican on October 17, 2006 at 6:41 PM
    Libertarian, the burden proof is on the students, unfortunately because it is us that want change. "It is a bit uncomfortable, and read up on the new ID policy. Many ESOL and other groups (Freshmen especially this week) are embarassed because it is obvious that they are in that academy/program/grade. " Sure, I agree this has some bad consequences but as far as the IDs go, they are not that bad. Besides, I doubt idiots would simply beat up a person for wearing an ID of a certain color. You can be just as stupid as to be ashamed of your skin color. "Books and paper have specific uses in school, ID's do not. " Id's are the only obvious connection between the administration and the students. Even though this is easily circumvented, it is the best and cost-effective method that I can think of. Why don't you think of some easier and better method of keeping track of 3 thousand people and present it to the administration? "And here you address only the new policy. I'm questioning the entire policy of having mandatory ID's (we're the only MCPS school that has that BTW) to be worn at all times in the building. And you saying that "there is nothing wrong with it" doesn't make it so. If you could use a few facts that would be nice. " How can I have facts against IDs if there's nothing worng with them? What is bad with IDs in general? As I said before, they do not hurt you at all; they're not bad at all. "I have continually pointed fingers at the problems and the fact that despite that the administration continues to enforce the policy. Who else should I point my finger at for enforcing a dumb policy?" The only facts/arguments you have against IDs are that you do not see any use. Again, I'll repeat myself: they are the only connection between the administration and hte students. Besides the silly reasons that Apathetic pointed out about the problems with IDs, there are nothing bad about IDs. As for the punishments, why not point fingers at your fellow students who do not wear their IDs as they are told and collect hundreds of dollars worth of IDs? Apathetic, in order to make some of your points, you must first show why IDs are bad. "The main issue is the uselessness and pointlessness of IDs. What other school has them? Blair is defintely not the most dangerous school in the county." We may not be the most dangerous but we're smack dab in the middle of the largest(?) city in Montgomery County and the largest high school in Montgomery County. Using other schools as examples is silly; you must show why they don't use IDs. Otherwise, so what matters if other schools don't make students wear IDs? Also, for those of you who are still confused, it's really easy to get a replacement ID. Go somewhere around the main office and ask where to buy a new ID. Stick that replacement in your backpack so whenever you forget your old one, you can always have the replacement one ready. It's not that hard.
  • A.S. Wright on October 18, 2006 at 8:28 PM
    Here's an idea. How about just sucking it up and wearing the ID's. If you spent as much time on either school work or on outside activities that are in some way significant as you do complaining, you might actually enjoy life.
  • wondering on October 19, 2006 at 6:34 PM
    hey so I have an unrelated question for all of you "regular" posters on these ID stories...
    Republican, Libertarian, Eli Barnett, Apathetic, Anarchist, etc. Have you guys had a meeting in person to discuss these issues? Do you have a plan of action? Is there a day where everyone is planning on throwing their IDs in a giant bin that I don't know about? Because it would be great if something like that was happening? It just seems slightly useless to argue back and forth on silverchips when meeting in person may be more effective? I think everyone would like to know if there is some plan of action that you geniuses have conjured?
  • Libertarian (View Email) on October 19, 2006 at 9:29 PM
    To A.S. Wright:

    and if the slaves simply sucked it up they would have realized they had free room and board and didn't have to think. Great life, huh? Why were they spending so much time fighting it?

    Yes that's extreme, but it's the same logic. Read the most recent Silver Chips? They still want to put ID scanners at the door. We are making a fuss about this and Gainous has budged little by little on the ID policy (so now Saturday detention is only if you refuse to wear an ID and I think it's 5 times before you get a parent conference forgetting ID's instead of 3).

    Although the media did blow this out of proportion, it's putting pressure on the administration, and that's a good thing. Keep letting them know that we will not take this useless ID policy that does nothing for the school.

    To wondering: I do not know any of the other people listed there in person and if I do I don't know they're using that name. Although thanks for calling me a genius, but I'm really just your everyday blazer who likes to express his views here. Hopefully a few of you agree with what I say.
  • Apathetic on October 19, 2006 at 11:57 PM
    Republican,
    I would like to point out that I don't believe that they're bad--just completely useless. The "harms" I pointed out are rather trivial, but take into account that without this useless policy those trivial harms would not be an issue.

    "We may not be the most dangerous but we're smack dab in the middle of the largest(?) city in Montgomery County and the largest high school in Montgomery County. Using other schools as examples is silly; you must show why they don't use IDs. Otherwise, so what matters if other schools don't make students wear IDs? "

    If using other schools as examples is silly, then so is using Blair's location as a defense. We have closed lunch. We cannot go off campus any time that we are required to have IDs on. I fail to see the connection between being in a large city (which we are not allowed to go into) and wearing IDs. Please enlighten me. Now, while on the topic of being silly, I will use a "silly" example. BCC has open lunch--they are right in the middle of downtown Bethesda. If location is such an issue, why do they not have IDs? Considering the amount of money they have (cyber cafe, etc.) they could easily install scanners. But they don't. Why? Because they recognize that IDs are useless.

    Additionally, we are also getting smaller. Are you saying that, once we cease to become the most populous high school, we don't need IDs anymore?

    I would also like to address your belief that the burden of proof is on the students. The administration implemented the policy; they believe it is useful. That is why they are enforcing it. Think of it this way. They are, in a sense, prosecuting the students for not wearing IDs. Thus, they must prove that it is a worthwhile issue, and that it DOES make a difference.

    To A.S. Wright:
    Here's an idea. Maybe we are successful enough to be active, while ALSO doing well academically and having a life. I know I'm enjoying my life, despite whatever crap I'm going through. I am doing no less than 5 extracurriculars, some in school, some not. I am willing to bet that I am much more productive, even while participating here, than you are.

    The reason that I (I can't speak for the others) don't just "suck it up" and wear IDs is that I believe this is unjust and unreasonable. If I let myself be pushed around by unreasonable and unexplained acts, then I don't deserve to call myself a citizen. If more people cared about the state of affairs, more people would go out to vote. People who just "suck it up" and take what comes at them can never make a difference, and can never make their voice heard. If you want to get pushed around all the time, feel free. I'm not going to blindly follow an inadequately explained/reasoned policy.

    To Wondering:
    I believe Libertarian is working on a petition? Libertarian, please clarify, thanks. Also, we're not just regular posters on ID stories; we post on others as well ^_~

    To Republican (again):
    Since your argument is directed at Liberatarian, I will not address them at the moment. Also because I'm out of time, haha.
  • Libertarian (View Email) on October 20, 2006 at 12:54 AM
    To Republican: "Libertarian, the burden proof is on the students, unfortunately because it is us that want change." To prove what? You can't prove a negative. Their statement is that ID's contribute to safety. I say that's complete nonsense (today's word brought to you by the FCC). I can provide examples of how ID's won't help, but if the administration wants to prove that they contribute to safety, all they have to do is come up with ONE scenario. Quite easy if it really did. So far I've been able to shoot down every single one easily. I can disprove all the examples, but that doesn't prove anything. It's on the administration to prove their statement. Until they do so all I can say is there is no proof that their statement is true. "'Books and paper have specific uses in school, ID's do not. ' Id's are the only obvious connection between the administration and the students. Even though this is easily circumvented, it is the best and cost-effective method that I can think of. Why don't you think of some easier and better method of keeping track of 3 thousand people and present it to the administration?" I'll present what they and we all know. There are other big schools in the county. None have a mandatory ID policy. It does absolutely nothing, and this "it's the best we can do" attitude doesn't work. Having no mandatory ID's is better than the current policy, so this is NOT the best we can do. "How can I have facts against IDs if there's nothing worng with them? What is bad with IDs in general? As I said before, they do not hurt you at all; they're not bad at all." I asked for facts for ID's contributing to safety, not for facts against ID's. I have plenty of those on my side. What is bad? Possible suspension? They aren't particularly fun to wear. You can be suspended for forgetting something that is entirely pointless. If I choose not to wear them what is your basis for telling me to do so? I'm sure you were ok with the stars for Jews too. I will oppose any and all instances I see of any power, be the federal, state, local government, or the school administration making rules or giving themselves power for the sake of power. They should be able to justify every power they are given. They can't do that for this and I will oppose it. Good enough for you? "The only facts/arguments you have against IDs are that you do not see any use. Again, I'll repeat myself: they are the only connection between the administration and hte students." What is a connection between the administration and the students? What do you mean here? I honestly don't understand what you're trying to say here. "Besides the silly reasons that Apathetic pointed out about the problems with IDs, there are nothing bad about IDs." Read above. "As for the punishments, why not point fingers at your fellow students who do not wear their IDs as they are told and collect hundreds of dollars worth of IDs?" hmm, an administration giving stupid punishments (and $5 for ID's? In their dreams) for stupid rules, some people don't follow the stupid rules and I'm supposed to be angry at my fellow students? "Apathetic, in order to make some of your points, you must first show why IDs are bad." That's ok, I just did above. "We may not be the most dangerous but we're smack dab in the middle of the largest(?) city in Montgomery County and the largest high school in Montgomery County. Using other schools as examples is silly; you must show why they don't use IDs. Otherwise, so what matters if other schools don't make students wear IDs?" A school is a school. Please explain to me the difference between a school of 2,000 kids in a medium city and a school of 3,000 kids in a big city. Is there no crime in other cities? How do ID's solve this problem? "Also, for those of you who are still confused, it's really easy to get a replacement ID. Go somewhere around the main office and ask where to buy a new ID. Stick that replacement in your backpack so whenever you forget your old one, you can always have the replacement one ready. It's not that hard." It costs $5, and is pointless, just put an extra string in your backpack. You might need something shaped like an ID, but I've seen people walk right past security people with old ID's on (they're horizontally oriented rather than vertically so it should be obvious). ID's are not a feasible solution because all a person trying to break into the school would need would be a plastic card and string.
  • Someone you may know on October 20, 2006 at 3:56 PM
    "ID's are not a feasible solution because all a person trying to break into the school would need would be a plastic card and string." -- Libertarian

    Just to add on [I completely agree]
    You don't even need the plastic card. I have successfully walked around with only a lanyard and gotten past even the most scrutinous teachers. I've seen students walk past security guards without an ID or a lanyard of any sort.

    Or, someone could break into our school just by being an adult. Do security guards even check adults for IDs?
  • Republican on October 20, 2006 at 8:26 PM
    IDs are the only connection between the administration and the students. The only easy way for the administration to check if a person actually belongs to this school is by their IDs. The other methods I can think of are to check with some other picture ID like a driver's license with a list of names, which is extremely inefficient. Well, this isn't an argument for why we must wear our IDs around our necks but this is a good argument for why IDs are needed. "I would also like to address your belief that the burden of proof is on the students. The administration implemented the policy; they believe it is useful. That is why they are enforcing it. Think of it this way. They are, in a sense, prosecuting the students for not wearing IDs. Thus, they must prove that it is a worthwhile issue, and that it DOES make a difference." You sound as if the administration and we are equals. We are not equals; the administration has the final say on everything. We are mere students in the school. The administration can make whatever they want and enforce whatever they want. The only way for us mere students to do anything about it is to show that the administration is wrong. The administration does not need to justify their actions, we need to justify why their actions are bad. "To prove what? You can't prove a negative." You can prove why IDs are bad. All your reasons are geared toward how IDs do not help. As I said in the above paragraph, IDs are the only connection between the administration and students. There is a reason why they do help, so all your reasons for why IDs do not help do not work. Sure, as you have shown, in some ways, IDs are useless, but in other ways, IDs are useful. "I asked for facts for ID's contributing to safety, not for facts against ID's. I have plenty of those on my side. What is bad? Possible suspension? They aren't particularly fun to wear. You can be suspended for forgetting something that is entirely pointless. If I choose not to wear them what is your basis for telling me to do so? I'm sure you were ok with the stars for Jews too. I will oppose any and all instances I see of any power, be the federal, state, local government, or the school administration making rules or giving themselves power for the sake of power. They should be able to justify every power they are given. They can't do that for this and I will oppose it. Good enough for you? " So the administration makes us wear ID because they feel the need to exercise their power? So the administration is so power-hungry that they would make all the students wear IDs? I do not think becoming the administration of a public high school would be the best place to satisfy such needs. You overestimate the "evilness" of the administration and you exaggerate what the administration is doing. As I said above, IDs are the only thing between the administration and the students. It's the only thing that passes between the administration's hands and the students' hands. There is nothing else connecting these two groups. Is that not enough reason for how IDs contribute to safety? The cost is mandated by the county and enforcement of this policy is the only way to ensure that all the students would have an ID. And yet, you still complain about the cost. The administration is not getting anything out of this. They are not benefiting themselves with these 5 dollars that they get for IDs. The money goes to the school fund, not to the paychecks of the administration. Libertarian, but then again, you might change directions and ask why wearing the ID would provide safety whereas as Apathetic pointed out, BCC do not require their students to wear IDs. Now, how is this a shortcoming of our administration and not the shortcoming of BCC's administration? The only way for IDs to serve their purpose is to have them clearly visible so people can be identified. And now, you're saying how BCC's administration is correct in not making students wear their IDs? By putting their IDs in the pockets, there is no difference between the outsider and the student. Now, let's bring this to the new policy that made everyone angry. The new policy gives Saturday detention and suspension for refusing to wear IDs. This would be what the outsider would do, who doesn't have an ID. To discourage this, the harsh punishments come in. That is perfectly reasonable. To sum it all up, Libertarian, you showed some reasons why IDs are useless. I showed you why IDs are useful. You have not shown why the IDs are bad. You have only complained how you can see nothing useful about IDs; that is the only reason you have against IDs. "ID's are not a feasible solution because all a person trying to break into the school would need would be a plastic card and string." Let's look at this from the perspective of the idiot who wants to hurt some people. That idiot can either go to wide open street and shoot people or he can come to Blair and shoot some people. At the street where he belongs, he can fit right in. At Blair however, I doubt that idiot would have enough willpower to observe the students and realize it is possible to enter without IDs or to just tie a string around his neck. The only thing the person probably knows is that Blair "requires" students to wear IDs, which would require more work than hurting people where he belong. Now, you might point out that if a criminal who really only wants to come to the school and hurt some students, nothing can stop him. Yes that's true, but what is the difference between BCC vs. criminal and Blair vs. criminal? Nothing. The ID policy stops that previous idiot off the street whereas the previous idiot might not even think twice before walking into BCC. However, for the criminal who tries very hard to get into Blair, I agree with you, IDs do nothing. "If using other schools as examples is silly, then so is using Blair's location as a defense. We have closed lunch. We cannot go off campus any time that we are required to have IDs on." Very good, now we're thinking along the same lines. Using what other schools do is not an argument; it's only something you can draw examples off of. Eli, read the above.
  • Libertarian (View Email) on October 21, 2006 at 10:33 PM
    I have no problem with ID's, most schools have them. I do have a problem forcing kids to have them on at all times.

    "Now, you might point out that if a criminal who really only wants to come to the school and hurt some students, nothing can stop him. Yes that's true, but what is the difference between BCC vs. criminal and Blair vs. criminal? Nothing. The ID policy stops that previous idiot off the street whereas the previous idiot might not even think twice before walking into BCC. However, for the criminal who tries very hard to get into Blair, I agree with you, IDs do nothing." - Republican

    You don't have to try hard. If it's someone with a weapon, how are ID's going to stop them? A staff memeber will say "Where's your ID?" and they'll pull out their gun. What did the ID policy do there?

    The only way a PERFECT ID policy (where instantly the administration would be able to see who had one on and who didn't, and every student wore their ID's) would catch someone would be if they didn't go to Blair, didn't have a weapon, and cared enough about not getting caught to sneak in and wait to beat up kids, but didn't care enough to fake an ID or temporary ID. In other words, NONE.

    To sum it up, I agree with you on ID's. They are useful to have, but there is no reason to foce kids to wear them at all times. None.
  • Republican on October 22, 2006 at 6:54 AM
    How can IDs serve their purpose if they are in the students' pockets? By forcing students to wear them, security can see that the person belongs in the building.

    "The only way a PERFECT ID policy (where instantly the administration would be able to see who had one on and who didn't, and every student wore their ID's) would catch someone would be if they didn't go to Blair, didn't have a weapon, and cared enough about not getting caught to sneak in and wait to beat up kids, but didn't care enough to fake an ID or temporary ID. In other words, NONE. "
    Faking an ID or temporary ID takes time, probably an hour or so but it would still take time. The person who wishes to hurt someone would view this time as a waste because the street is an equally good option. However, for the person who wishes to hurt someone specifically inside the school building, IDs do nothing.

    In addition, random people who do not wish to do anything at all can just walk into Blair. Blair should not be treated as a shortcut for passerby.

    "To sum it up, I agree with you on ID's. They are useful to have, but there is no reason to foce kids to wear them at all times. None."
    Yes, but there are many doors in Blair that people constantly come in and go out of. There's no guarantee that all of these people coming in are actually students.

    Put it in other terms, the administration labels everyone who does not belong in the building a security concern, whether carrying a weapon or not. They attempt to identify these security concerns by if the person wears an ID or not. To the insider, it seems stupid because many people do not wear IDs. But to the outsider, it seems as a possible venue to get caught so they do not attempt to enter the school. It's a good plan that eliminates many potential trespassers.

    For those trespassers who solely wish to get into Blair, IDs will not stop them. They cannot prevent fights; they cannot prevent any of the large crimes that you can think of. Wearing the ID around your neck does not do many things, but it does let the administration know you belong in the building. Having it in your back pocket does not tell the administration if you belong in the building or not.

    I think the reason most of the news reporters stressed the colors of the IDs even though it was not a major problem was because they see nothing wrong with the actual ID policy itself. It probably seems perfectly reasonable to them and not newsworthy at all. The colors don't really cause that much of a problem as well.
  • Libertarian (View Email) on October 22, 2006 at 11:10 AM
    an HOUR to fake an ID??? More like 2 minutes. I get a colored sticker, write my name and ID number on it, and there I've got a fake ID. It isn't that hard.

    And give me a break. The reason we have ID's is so people don't cut through the building and use it as a shortcut?

    And the news reporters picked a story based on what they thought would boost ratings. Unfortunately that's their job. A segregation accusation is much more exciting than a simple stupid rule by the administration. Those happen all the time.
  • Someone you may know on October 22, 2006 at 12:56 PM
    To Republican
    How would faking an ID take an hour? What, does the person plan to make the paper for the Post-It note from scratch?
  • Republican on October 22, 2006 at 8:22 PM
    Even if making an ID does not take much time, I doubt the person who would try to break in would know how easy it is to dupe the administration. It is just another way they can get caught.

    The shortcut example was to show how easily someone can cut through the building.

    Seeing how you didn't bring up any arguments, I guess you guys agree that IDs are useful and it makes sense to wear it visibly.
  • capn crunch on October 23, 2006 at 3:29 PM
    okay. i'll agree that IDs are the only connection between the administration and the students for the most part. however, thats a major problem in itself.

    ill use watkins mill as an example here. according to some friends of mine at the school , the principal knows every single person in the school. how many of you can say mr gainous knows your name? and not from a meeting with him becuase you got in trouble for something? im sure you can argue against this by saying that its impossible to know 3,000 peoples names, and ill concede that point. however, watkins mill is not a small school, as i'm fairly confident it has over 1,000 students. if you consider that the maximum of people the principal can know in person, then mr gainous should be able to name at least a third of our students. however, this is obviously not the case. why? he has no presence in the school. i see him in person maybe 5 times a year, excluding assemblies and such. the principal of watkins mill stands at the door every morning and greets everyone who walks in. what if we could get a couple administrators to spend 20 to 30 minutes every morning just saying hello to people walking in? apparently they have more important things to do, like make ESOL students stand out with bright yellow IDs, or have conferences with students and their parents about forgetting IDs at home. to me, the administration doesn't care.

    republican said that we aren't equals with the administration. why not? they have the power, but are they better people than us? i think not. if the administration treated everyone the way theyd like to be treated, i think our school would be a much better learning environment.


    the fact that IDs are the only connection between the students and administration is the entire reason why the ID policy is the abominiation it has come to be. in the administrations eyes, we're simply objects to be labeled according to our specific purpose (media literacy, international studies, magnet, esol) and controlled, instead of people who should have a say to how they are treated and are more than just things to be played with.
  • capn crunch (View Email) on October 24, 2006 at 12:55 PM
    to republican:
    "For those trespassers who solely wish to get into Blair, IDs will not stop them. They cannot prevent fights; they cannot prevent any of the large crimes that you can think of. Wearing the ID around your neck does not do many things, but it does let the administration know you belong in the building. Having it in your back pocket does not tell the administration if you belong in the building or not. "

    The problem here is that many students do just keep it in their backpacks or pockets a lot of the time. If the administration approches them, then they can easily get it out and show that they do in fact belong in the school. This is the policy used at basically every other school in the county. All students are required to have their ID to prove they belong but they only need to show it if someone thinks that they might not belong. Like I said before, if the administration got to know some portion of our students this would additionally make it easier for them to spot outsiders.

    Also, try this if you are not wearing an ID and a teacher or administrator asks you to put it on: simply stick your hand in one of your pockets and fidget around, or open a pocket of your backpack and pretend to look for it, and nothing will happen to you. Or simply say "I guess I lost it" and they'll send to you the security or attendance office to get a new one, but they don't escort you there so in effect they have done nothing. Think about it, this course of action seems to go on the idea that if you dont have an ID, the administration knows that you still belong because they simply tell you to go get a new one, instead of ensuring that you actually do get a new one or belong at all.

    And again, if you have a fake ID -- a colored sticker with scribbled writing or a white card on a sdtring or simply a piece of string or a lanyard around your neck, you won't be approached to begin with.


    Another question for you: Do you see the redundancy in this request?: "John, put your ID on." It proclaims that the speaker knows you belong, but for some reason it's necessary to prove to them by putting something around your neck -- whether it's a real ID or a fake one made in less than 5 minutes.
  • Someone you may know on October 24, 2006 at 8:52 PM
    To Republican:
    "Seeing how you didn't bring up any arguments, I guess you guys agree that IDs are useful and it makes sense to wear it visibly."
    What? Just because someone does not wish to reiterate the points they have stated does not mean that they agree with your point. Hey, if that were true, we could say the administration thinks IDs are useless because they dodge direct questions about the necessity of IDs.

    "I doubt the person who would try to break in would know how easy it is to dupe the administration."
    If I was that determined to get into the school, I would find out how to get around the administration. One possible method is reading Silver Chips, which now has many articles about IDs and ID policy. Also, someone trying to break into the school could have a friend at Blair that mentions offhandedly about how they wore someone else's ID, just wore a lanyard for the day, have their old temporary ID, etc without being bothered by an administrator. I've mentioned how easy it is to go into our school to non Blazers.


    To capn crunch:
    I agree wholeheartedly with your point about it is sad that IDs are the only connection between the students and the administration! I didn't know the name of our principal until my sophomore year and even then, I was not able to visually identify him. For a long time, I thought he was just another staff member.
  • Blazer on October 25, 2006 at 12:42 AM
    I don't care about the punishment as much as I care about people actually being safe in an emergency. "capn crunch" pretty much hit the nail on the head. Currently, IDs are useless. If we weren't allowed inside without an ID, that would be annoying, but it would be better than the current situation.

    I would have no problem wearing IDs if they did something. And I wouldn't have a problem not wearing them. Wearing them when they don't do anything is a waste.
  • capn crunch (View Email) on October 25, 2006 at 3:46 PM
    well said, Blazer.

    if the ID policy accomplished something, for example guaranteeing that no outsiders who did not have a genuine reason to come into blair were admitted, it would be a very different situation. attempting to find intruders among a sea of students, some with and some without IDs on is ineffective and pointless.

    the only way this ID policy would work is if EVERY student was wearing an ID at all times, very clearly visible from a distance as a genuine ID. the chances of that happening are, as we all know, zero.

    the only ID policy we should have is to prove we are who we say we are when its necessary to do so, for things such as sporting events, buying lunch, borrowing materials from the library, and perhaps when substitutes are taking attendance. or in the rare case the administration has reason to believe we are trespassing in their precious territory intent on doing harm.
  • Eli Barnett on October 26, 2006 at 5:04 PM
    The ID policy was, no doubt, changed before the question and answer session. In my opinion, its still useless, but its much less unfair to the students now. Allow me to list some of the problems that were fixed

    saturday detentions: these are now only handed out if you stand up to a teacher and say "no", which most agree is wrong

    punishments for forgetting: these shouldnt really exist at all, but now you have to forget 6 times before anything is done, and some other amount before any "harsh" punishments are handed out. Not perfect, but an improvement

    color coded: i learned today that the ESOL color was changed, a definite turn for the better.

    All in all, the administration did listen to the students (thankfully). the policy may still be useless, but it is no longer overly strict, and as long as you dont forget your ID a rediculous amount of times (6-8 per quarter) the "clarifications" or "revisions" made it more acceptable. Im not saying the policy is correct, it most definitely is still useless and a bit of a hastle, but its really not worth a big protest about now that it has been "clarified".
  • Republican on October 26, 2006 at 7:31 PM
    "What? Just because someone does not wish to reiterate the points they have stated does not mean that they agree with your point."
    Please very briefly point out the points I did not address; I believed I addressed all of them. If I have addressed all of your points, then you’re against something you have no reason to be against.

    capn crunch, you mention Watkins Mill as an example of a good high school. Yes, I agree, it is a very nice way to get to know the students and let the students feel they are welcome in the school. However, if that is the only identification system they have, there would be some major problems. First, there are doors that people can enter through anytime during the day. Unless there is a principal or administrator assigned to every single door in the school, Watkin Mill's "security system" (that you pointed out) is not very effective in dealing with the intruder.

    I agree that the ID system is not perfect. That does not mean the ID system is not needed. Some of the flaws are that the student body does not wish to wear the ID. The student body is not able to point out anything wrong with IDs except that IDs are useless. Then, yet again, capn crunch pointed out nicely that only if everyone wears their IDs shown clearly, then the ID policy would work. It isn't hard to draw the connection that wearing the ID would result in a safer school. In addition, IDs do not hurt you; no one was able to point out anything bad about IDs themselves except some extremely silly and pathetic reasons that “Someone you may know” pointed out. Scratch your heads a couple of times and realize that if you wear your ID, then IDs would be useful so you would become willing to wear your ID.

    Again, I’ll reiterate this point: there’s no perfect way to protect this school from intruders. IDs are not supposed to stop intruders from coming into Blair. IDs are not even supposed to be a major part of our safety. They do nothing to help us against fights, fires, etc. Just because they do not save us from many of these safety concerns does not mean IDs are useless. The administration sees anyone who doesn’t belong in the building as a security concern. Everyone should make the connection that someone who doesn’t belong in the building is a problem. Everyone should see that the only way to see if someone belongs in the building or not is by some form of ID. Everyone should see that the only way to check for this form of ID is to have it shown prominently on the person. How does this not make perfect sense?

    As some of you have pointed out, the only remaining problem is that a lot of the school population does not wear their IDs. Why? Because they are not bright enough to make the connection pointed out in the above paragraph. The only way to show these less fortunate people is by example, where wearing an ID is not that bad and would not make the wearer unpopular. By not wearing your ID, you are detracting from the school’s safety.
  • capn crunch (View Email) on October 27, 2006 at 5:34 PM
    republican,

    watkins mill has an ID policy like every other school in the county; students are expected to be able to show them upon request if there is reason to believe they do not belong.


    i was suggesting that our admins should have a stronger connection on a personal level with its students.


    and spotting someone not wearing an ID is much more difficult than noticing someone who is behaving suspiciously. I think IDs should only be checked when there is probable cause to believe the person in question does not belong.
  • Republican on October 28, 2006 at 8:19 AM
    "i was suggesting that our admins should have a stronger connection on a personal level with its students. "
    Standing next to the door and saying hello to all the students is not security. Nice of you to see the difference now.


    "and spotting someone not wearing an ID is much more difficult than noticing someone who is behaving suspiciously."

    Someone acting suspicious is not that easy to see. I doubt even the idiots that would decide to come to the school would decide to pick a lock to a door in a hallway full of students. Instead, I believe they would walk through the halls like any other student. There's nothing suspicious about walking. They walk through Blair and go through a door on the opposite end. Nothing suspicious. Many students walk through Blair each day as well.


    "I think IDs should only be checked when there is probable cause to believe the person in question does not belong."
    That is just pathetic. You do not wait until a person pulls a knife out that you ask to check for their ID. "Sir, please don't stab. Please show us your ID." silly

    Get over it, IDs are good.
  • capn crunch (View Email) on October 29, 2006 at 6:21 PM
    republican


    your logic implies that the only security threat at blair is by people who aren't wearing IDs. if your hypothetical knife-wielder is wearing an ID, then no one would approach him to question him according to your viewpoint. ID wearing does not at all influence the behavior a person exhibits. I don't relaly know how else to say it except that your logic is fulls of flaws and fallacies. how it is easier to notice someone in a crowd of students who is not wearing an ID than to notice someone behaving nervously and suspiciously I really don't understand.
  • Republican on October 30, 2006 at 6:14 PM
    "your logic implies that the only security threat at blair is by people who aren't wearing IDs."
    Just because the only security threats I _mentioned_ are by people not wearing IDs does not mean I think the only security threats at Blair is by people who aren't wearing IDs. When you criticize someone's words, make sure you read all the words first.

    "if your hypothetical knife-wielder is wearing an ID, then no one would approach him to question him according to your viewpoint. ID wearing does not at all influence the behavior a person exhibits."
    It's nice to see that you agree with me. IDs do not stop people with knives. I said that very nicely and I am very happy that you finally realize that. You put too much hope on IDs. I've countlessly before stated that IDs do not stop knife-wielders or fights. Instead, IDs only identify students from non-students.

    "I don't relaly know how else to say it except that your logic is fulls of flaws and fallacies."
    Maybe if your reading comprehension was better...

    If you do not have anything to say, don't force things to make some "argument." If there is nothing you can find to support your argument, then that would mean your argument is incorrect.
  • capn crunch (View Email) on November 2, 2006 at 4:23 PM
    no.
  • marxist on October 26, 2007 at 11:20 PM
    I'm amazed nobody has mentioned the real reason the school system stresses the ID policy so much: they are raking in the dough from forgotten or lost IDs. They essentially have a monopoly on the ID market, and $5 for a careless mistake is ROBBERY. As previously stated, students can owe $100 for IDs. They are a simple source of constant income for the school, almost like taxes.
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